[Podast] Joining Tractebel means "opening up to the world"!

Daphné: You've had quite an atypical professional career. You spent a large part of your career in the army, in the Navy in particular, and then you decided to train as a nuclear engineer. These are generally fields in which women are a minority. What motivated you to make these career choices?

Karen: I'd say it's destiny. When I was very young, I dreamed of being a veterinarian, which has nothing to do with nuclear power. I used to go sailing every summer with my father and my brother joined the French Navy as well. So, little by little, it intrigued me and my choice of career came quite naturally. In 26 years in the French Navy, I've experienced both the operational and technological aspects. I was able to combine this military role with nuclear engineering very quickly. When I joined the Navy, I wanted to serve on the Charles De Gaulle aircraft carrier and my dream at the time was also to embark on the nuclear submarines, which came true in 2016. It also shows that nuclear power is in fact a very open and diverse field. We often think only of the nuclear industry, which produces electricity. And ultimately, you can have a career in the nuclear sector, not in the industry, but in defense or research. Today I'm in the industry, and perhaps if I hadn't worked in defense, I wouldn't be working for Tractebel today.

Daphné: Yes, the nuclear industry is much more diverse than most people think. What are the highlights of your career?

Karen: There are both personal and professional moments.  Personally, what really marked my career was when I became a mother and went on an operational mission when my son was two years old. Those were special moments because I was away for 6 months at the time, and then I went on one mission after another. And that had a huge impact on me. Our son is waiting for us on the quay, he sees the boat and we show him around, and all that.

And professionally, it's being able to join the nuclear submarines. It was a dream I'd had since I joined the Navy. I was actually able to get a real feel for this very masculine world, because I was part of the first female crew. I was the first head of the reactor department on a nuclear-powered ballistic missile submarine, which is a pillar of France's nuclear deterrent. What also impressed me was the crew spirit. And today, in industry, it's all about teamwork.

As I've seen throughout my career, you can be a Chef or a Manager and therefore give orders and take decisions, prioritise and talk to your teams. But in fact, it works both ways. There has to be mutual trust between the team and its leader. The strongest moments were the exchanges I was able to have with my crew, because we were in a closed environment for months on end, whether on a boat or a submarine, like a family being created. Hierarchical links exist, of course, as in industry. But these links are created through relationships.

Daphné: And as a woman in a management position, I suppose you've had the opportunity to manage more experienced men. How did that go? 

Karen: Yes, I've had many opportunities to lead men more experienced than myself. In all my officer positions, that was the case. Being in the energy sector, it's obviously a very male-dominated environment. In my first post, I was a young lieutenant in the conventional steam sector. My direct assistants had joined the French Navy the year I was born, in 1976. So inevitably a young woman arriving to take on the role of chief is looked at a bit sideways. I've held a lot of positions in which I was the first woman: first head of a boilermaking workshop group, first head of machinery on a refuelling tanker, first woman head of department on a nuclear submarine and in conventional steam. The first contact was always very tough, let's face it.

I think you have to prove yourself more than a man. On my first night watch on a boat (where the activity never stops), I was in charge of the propulsion plant management team and my deputy didn't speak to me for 4 hours, not a word. So I said to myself, "Either I stay like this, I'm not going to learn anything, I'm not going to make any connections, I'm going to get bored and I'm going to go home sad and disappointed; or I take charge of my own life". And that's what I did. I talked to the team, I went down to the machine room in my overalls and I learnt little by little. My old hands started talking to me and took me under their wing a bit. When decisions had to be made, I was there to take them. In fact, you have to force the dialogue, force your position. However, just because you're a woman doesn't mean you have to play a particular role. 

A leader is there to decide, but he decides on the basis of the feedback he receives from his team and the mutual trust within the team. It's this learning process that has served me well throughout my career. Taking an interest in the work of my team is very important. That's how you develop your skills and know-how, but also your interpersonal skills, because it all shapes you. So I've applied this method to all my jobs.

And it still works today. I'm still in regular contact with my older and younger colleagues. The role of the chef is also to make decisions. Even if we make a mistake, that's part of our role. On the other hand, for me, not to decide is a clear failure.

Daphné: I can see that you've managed to stay true to yourself and prove yourself. And what was it, after your fascinating career in the army, that motivated you to join Tractebel? 

Karen : There are several reasons for this. First of all, I wanted to get out of Defence. I didn't necessarily want to work on defence issues any more. Working for the power plants in Belgium gave me a complete change of field, environment and country with different regulations. So there was that first challenge. The other reason, which really made me want to come, was the diversity of cultures. When I was in the Navy I was able to talk to foreign Marines and visit many countries. You realise that when you travel and meet people of different nationalities, you understand the world around you a lot better. You have to open up to the world, share and exchange with different cultures.

And when I had the opportunity to join Tractebel, I said to myself that this was exactly what I had done in the Navy, because today I have engineers in my team who come from very different countries, with whom I can discuss their training... It gives me ideas for my son. I tell myself that he needs to open up to the world. In fact, that's how you progress. Beyond the diploma aspect, it's so enriching and so I thought it was a way for me to find another way of enriching myself in terms of know-how of course, but also in terms of interpersonal skills. So it's a question of continuity. 

I can transfer my experience in the Navy to Tractebel and that's really important to me. That's why I joined Tractebel without any apprehension. It was a 'let's go' opportunity, a new mission that allowed me to open up to the world, and what's more, without going too far away.

Daphné: Opening up to the world is a great reason to join Tractebel. It's true that Tractebel is a company that brings together many nationalities and has offices in several countries around the world. I have one last question to ask. What advice would you give to a young woman considering joining the nuclear industry?

Karen: There's a saying in the Navy: "If you're wondering whether to ask the question, you should have done it already! So any woman wondering whether she should join the industry should go for it. That's the spirit that has driven me throughout my career.

As soon as I had an opportunity, I seized it to move forward. That's why I've worked in so many different fields. I haven't just worked in nuclear power. I've worked in human resources, boiler making and training. I finished my military career at the Naval Staff, working in liaison with the office of the Minister of the Armed Forces. As soon as you ask yourself the question, you have to go for it. As I often say, "you have to dare". In my life, I observed what was around me, what I liked and didn't like, and I told myself that I wanted to learn.

I hate routine. I want to learn to progress. I've listened to the advice of our elders, but also of young people because they have a different vision of the world. When I was a little girl, I was a bit of a dreamer. And I said to myself, dream, resist, laugh. What's really important is to have fun, to laugh. Of course, many people will say that you're not at work to laugh. But I believe that if you want to get ahead in life, you have to be happy. Laughter gives you energy. That's why you have to dare! What stops us from moving forward is less society or preconceived ideas than ourselves. Nobody has all the skills.

The only thing is to move forward to make progress. And that's it. And it was Nelson Mandela who always said: "You never fail. You either win or you learn". And that's a lesson I've learned.

Daphné: A great lesson in life, in any case. To all those listening to us today, as Karen says, "Dare", all the doors are open to you. Thank you very much Karen for taking the time to share your experience with us. I think this experience will be very inspiring for many of those listening to us.

I'll let you get back to your job, which is really vital not only for the nuclear industry, but also for the energy transition and the future of our society. Don't hesitate to apply to Tractebel if you want to work on stimulating and varied projects in a gender-balanced environment.

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